Condensed consolidating guarantor and non-guarantor financial information Condensed consolidating guarantor and non-guarantor financial information supplemental (Details) (USD $) In Millions, unless otherwise specified	3 Months Ended	9 Months Ended
	Jul. 31, 2012	Jul. 31, 2012
Defined Benefit Plan Net Tax	$ 0
Guarantor Subsidiaries [Member]
Defined Benefit Plan Net Tax	0	0
Non-Guarantor Subsidiaries [Member]
Defined Benefit Plan Net Tax	0	0
Consolidation, Eliminations [Member]
Defined Benefit Plan Net Tax	0	0
Consolidated Entities [Member]
Defined Benefit Plan Net Tax		0
Parent Company [Member]
Defined Benefit Plan Net Tax	$ 0	$ 0