Retirement, pension and other postretirement plans (Details 8) (Level 3 [Member], USD $) In Thousands, unless otherwise specified	12 Months Ended
Oct. 31, 2011	Oct. 31, 2010
Level 3 [Member]
Summary of changes in fair value of the pension plan investments
Balance at beginning of year	$ 17,699	$ 17,600
Net unrealized gains	55	692
Purchases, sales, issuances and settlements, net	679	(231)
Transfers in (out)	0
Foreign currency translation	68	(362)
Balance at end of year	$ 18,501	$ 17,699

Actual return on plan assets, separately identifying the amount related to assets still held at the reporting date.

Reference 1: http://www.xbrl.org/2003/role/presentationRef

-Publisher FASB

-Name Statement of Financial Accounting Standard (FAS)

-Number 132R

-Paragraph 5

-Subparagraph d(iv)(b)(i)

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- Definition

Assets, usually stocks, bonds, and other investments, that have been segregated and restricted (usually in a trust) to provide benefits, at their fair value as of the measurement date. Plan assets include amounts contributed by the employer (and by employees for a contributory plan) and amounts earned from investing the contributions, less benefits paid. If a plan has liabilities other than for benefits, those nonbenefit obligations may be considered as reductions of plan assets.

+ References

Reference 1: http://www.xbrl.org/2003/role/presentationRef

-Publisher FASB

-Name Statement of Financial Accounting Standard (FAS)

-Number 132R

-Paragraph 5

-Subparagraph b

Reference 2: http://www.xbrl.org/2003/role/presentationRef

-Publisher FASB

-Name Statement of Financial Accounting Standard (FAS)

-Number 132R

-Paragraph 5

-Subparagraph d(iv)(b)(i)

Reference 3: http://www.xbrl.org/2003/role/presentationRef

-Publisher FASB

-Name Statement of Financial Accounting Standard (FAS)

-Number 87

-Paragraph 49

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- Definition

The amount of increase or decrease in plan assets attributed to foreign currency changes. The effects of foreign currency exchange rate changes that are to be disclosed are those applicable to plans of a foreign operation whose functional currency is not the reporting currency.

+ References

Reference 1: http://www.xbrl.org/2003/role/presentationRef

-Publisher FASB

-Name Statement of Financial Accounting Standard (FAS)

-Number 132R

-Paragraph 5

-Subparagraph b

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- Definition

Purchases, sales, and settlements of plan assets that occurred during the period.

+ References

Reference 1: http://www.xbrl.org/2003/role/presentationRef

-Publisher FASB

-Name Statement of Financial Accounting Standard (FAS)

-Number 132R

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- Definition

Transfers in and out of Level 3. For example, transfers due to changes in the observability of significant inputs.

+ References

Reference 1: http://www.xbrl.org/2003/role/presentationRef

-Publisher FASB

-Name Statement of Financial Accounting Standard (FAS)

-Number 132R

-Paragraph 5

-Subparagraph d(iv)(b)(iii)

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